disciplin and step kids

[Stats]

Stats

[Waylon]

Is that the problem ... washing dishes.

Well, that was what you referred to specifically, so that's what I commented on.

What I'm trying to express is that there is a way to raise children without barking out like a drill sergeant.   

Different strokes for different folks....and not all children are as self-directed or as responsible as others. Some kids need a little more aggressive approach than others.

Needless to say I don't do very well with chores, curfews, bell-ringingsystems, division of labor, preferental treatment, PC, or being abusedbecause I'm a male.   

Because you're male, or because you're human? I don't think that this is necessarily a gender-based thing. At least not in my experience.

[Buff]

jessica78, please contact me via the system.  I'd like to share with you an age-old SM theory.  In the meantime, you are not the disciplinarian to your SS, you *are* however to your own kids, so that's the difference if your kids decide to start behaving like your SS.  It's up to dad to parent his child and he can do it even he he's not physically there. 

[ksmarks]

I agree you can't be expected to be the parent, however, you are the adult in the house and the primary care provider of the children.  If step sons actions would not be accepted as reasonable at a childcare providers then they are when he is with you.
 
If it is a reasonable request I expect that there will be compliance, just like the kids expect that money they have asked for to stop after the game for something to eat of whatever.
 
I demaded respect from all of our kids, his as well as mine, however, that is about as far as I went with his children, they have a mother, and a father, there was no way that I was going to win.
 
So I spent my time and energy on my own children, and I raised my kids with the life isn't fair, get over it, approach.  So even though I made my children do certain things that my step children didn't have to do, they knew their father and I had the belief that it was our responsibilty to raise them to be self supporting productive members of society.
 
My kids knew what the expectations were as well as potential consequences for non compliance, they also knew that dad & I were the adults and we did not negotiate with terrorist.
 
Dad should support your request for respect and compliance to reasonable requests, but after that he needs to make his kids responsible adults, you can do it for him.
 
Good Luck, goodness knows that this is a tough issue.

[Rave]

ACTUALLY I would like to know why you won't stop looking at yourself in the mirrorr, get off your .... onto your feet and WASH THE DISHES yourself.
That's probably what the boy wants to know as well he just hasn't mature enough to say it.

davy, it's obvious that you have been exposed to dysfunction through your entire life, from childhood to the present.   My guess is that you've developed quite an armor of defense to help you cope.  I'm also guessing, however, that your armor occasionally fools you into thinking your experiences justify the kind of summation you offered above.

It doesn't.  Hope that helps.

[Waylon]

ACTUALLY I would like to know why you won't stop looking at yourself in the mirrorr, get off your .... onto your feet and WASH THE DISHES yourself.
That's probably what the boy wants to know as well he just hasn't mature enough to say it.

Okay, I'm baffled. Why shouldn't male children be expected to help with household chores? What am I missing here? I know you well enough to doubt that this is your actual position on this subject.

[Davy]

Rave,  Way to go.  You are exposing yourself.  Are you jealous of my upbringing or my child rearing capabilities.  All three of my adult children are in "caring" professions...an RN, a missionary, a pastor turned Lawn care/Landscaper with a Masters degree.  All three are independent and the two with children are loving and nuturing to their children.

About the military draft.  Ding Ding.  Men of the draft generations (my dad and me) scoff at that craziness of women in combat and it cetainly doesn't compare to a female enlisting during the Gulf War.  Somehow I can not (and never did) invision my mother being drafted or my wife or sisters or girlfriends.  You must really be off your rocker.  I frequent a VA hospital regularly.  There is a few WWII around yet and plenty of Nam vets with missing limbs.  Funny how I have yet to meet a Gulf War vet.   

Oh and speaking of girlfriends ... our high graduating class is trying to organize a 60th birthday celebration and there was dysfunction among the committee.  A couple of the girls contacted me to intervene (miles away) to bring peace and stability to the group.  They thought I to be the only one that could do it graciously.  Thing are much better and will be great.  We all grew up together.  Is this the dysfunction I've been exposed to my entire life.   

This world is far apart of a step taking away a child's privilges, brow beating, etc then wondering why a child is rebellious, on drugs, in trouble at school and in the community and thinking they need a psych.  Most of the ones I know this happened to are either dead, homeless drunks, or in prison.

You might consider listening rather than reguritating you rude and obnoxious remarks.

[Davy]

Waylon.  You are so right it's not my actual position.
 
My sons worked in the kitchen and later in life became pretty good chefs (a lot better than me but that's not saying much).  All because they wanted to and not because they were told.
 
My daughter mowed the yard, washed the car, shoveled snow, etc  all because she wanted to.  And she usually did a better job than her brothers but they might want to argue that point.  Her brother (a yr younger) broke numerous state track records (8th grade) but he did'nt hold a candle to his sister ... and she was all lady to boot.  I was blessed.  Let me say that again cause I miss her so much.... she was all lady to boot.
 
The context to the previous posts enlightened my post (as I'm recalling ) because posters were, IMHO,  hammering the boy and his father because he refused to do the dishes when that was a symptom of the problem and not the cause.
 
Waylon, I'm not trying to criticize  parenting styles but I am asking for awareness, especially with step children ... my children's mother did a big about face in life and did nothing about the DV at the hands of the Step that resulted. They were not accustomed to "orders".  Once they were with me they started to function normally again.  I think it was the note I put on the frig :  remove all guns and ammo from your room, no blowing smoke in any body's face while they are eating, home every night for supper, no over night guest without advance notice and then only if I talk to their parents first, no drugs or alcohol in the house, etc.
Hope there is an understanding.   
 
 

[Buff]

I think we all need to remember that it's not necessarily accurate to project your experiences on everyone else.  IOW, what you experienced is not always what everyone else is going through.  Not all women are out to hurt their kids, and neither are all men, every situation is *different* and none of us are in a position to pass judgement. 

You might consider listening rather than reguritating you rude and obnoxious remarks.

I'll respectfully ask you to consider your own role in this. 

[Davy]

What say you.  Female posters jump up and belittle the father while hammering his son because the 15 yr old boy says washing dishes is for women and you think the hammering  is great and necessary.

Then rebuff a male poster for his child-rearing success or the way he was raised.... so what say you.

What to you want ??  Any questions ?  Please ask if you need advice.
 
OH !  Wait a minute .  I got it.  You think men and fatherhood is trivial.

[ksmarks]

I am so lost.... no one said anything about "men and fatherhood being trivial"
 
 

[Waylon]

Davy, you need to get a grip. Seriously.

...while hammering his son because the 15 yr old boy says washing dishes is for women

I'd hammer my own son if I heard him spouting nonsense like "washing dishes is for women". 

Then rebuff a male poster for his child-rearing success or the way he was raised....

Maybe I missed it, but I've not seen anyone rebuff you for being a successful parent. (??)

You think men and fatherhood is trivial.

I've also not seen anyone make this claim, either.

[ksmarks]

Davy I am all for venting, yet maybe starting a vent topic would be better?  Just a thought, that way we could stay on topic. ...
 
 Have a Great Father's Day Weekend!
 
K

[Davy]

Waylon .. as you should..because you are his father.  That is not the issue in this case. 
 
Or maybe it is because the father authority is not mentioned except to say he's hardly at home while the SM appears to be ranting and raving making demands handing out penalities, removing privileges, all while lacking respect.  Posters here joined the frey.
Perhaps the father has the full picture and is trying to find ways to bring peace and tranquilty to his household. 
 
Here's my strong opinion.  SM is an adult and the boy is being raised up and, I suspect, loves / misses his mother who he sees EOW.  Tough place to be for a 15 yr old boy.  SM is losing with her approach ... no doubt it works with the females in the household (they like it) ... all the yelling, etc but it is making this boy resentful, rebellous, etc.
 
What we should be doing as adults is to be loving, nuturing, encouraging, comforting, and letting the boy know we have an understanding for his station in life while maintaining a dignified but respectful authortarian position with the child.  We as adults should leave our egos behind and demonstrate warmth ... all the dysfunction will go away and then tranqility and responsible behavior will become the new life style.  Being heavy-handed, griping and complaining only makes matters worst.  My concern is for the child not the adult SM.
 
As for the posters that join SM frey's and look for ways to jump ugly on "Davy" you're simply not helping SM or anyone else that may be reading the post.
 
Do you realize how much more pertinant responses become when someone (like Waylon) interjects rationality ??

[gemini3]

I have to kind of agree with Davy's point about the kids wanting to help.  I mean, you can only "make" children do things for so long.  Eventually they get old enough to put their foot down, and usually do so with a vengence.  No one likes to be told what to do like they're servants in their own homes.
 
With my step-kids, we made a list of chores, responsibilities, and house rules.  They get marbles for doing the chores (more or less depending on the job), they lose marbles for breaking the rules.  The marbles can be cashed in for rewards.  They choose how much to do, and how much they want to make.  When my husband and I need help with something we ask for a volunteer.  Sometimes the volunteer gets marbles for helping, and sometimes they don't (the whole pavlov thing).  They climb over each other to volunteer because they know they might get rewarded.
 
If they want something big and a birthday/christmas isn't close they can choose to earn the money on their own.  We help them make a plan of how much they want to earn, and then what chores they will do to earn the money.  They do the chores because they want to, not because we make them.  But, if they choose not to participate in the household duties they don't get "extra's" - like playing video games, money for allowance, candy, etc.
 
As they get older some things that they get paid for become things that they get decutions for if they don't do them.  For example, brushing their teeth.  When they were little they got a marble if they brushed their teeth without being reminded.  Now they lose a marble if they don't do it.
 
We believe that this mirrors life when they leave the home.  We all get to choose how hard we want to work, and be rewarded (or suffer consequences) accordingly.